The title of this post was stolen from an episode of Larry King Live a couple of days ago, (minus the A Rant
part) which featured Bill Nye (yes, the science guy) debating with alleged “experts” in researching extraterrestrial involvement in military technology and the notorious “UFO crash” 61 years ago in Roswell, New Mexico. I caught the rerun last night when I couldn’t sleep and was inclined to post about it.
As the post implies, this is a rant, so here goes.
First off, I hated the title. Are UFO’s real? Of course they’re real. UFO’s are merely what they say they are: Unidentified Flying Objects. I believe some people overlook the acronym and associate it automatically with aliens. However, UFO is a term used quite frequently by the military, police force, etc. to describe aircraft that haven’t been identified as belonging to a specific group or country yet. Obviously this is nit-picking on my part, but come on, the title was a bit insulting.
Secondly, I was quite irritated that it was 4 (and at one point 5) on 1 for the most part. Bill Nye versus 5 nuts. Though he was holding his own, it was incredibly unfair. Bill had limited time to respond to everyone and in some cases wasn’t even given the apportunity to do so. This, I’m sure, swayed some viewers to believe the conspiracy theorists, after all, they did get to talk more. Fortunately, the times Bill was able to respond, he responded well and logically.
I was quite entertained at the conspiracy theorists when they presented “evidence” which consisted of a couple photos and the stories of a few people working on or near the area in which this top secret activity occurred. Some of the photos were so badly done, it was obvious they were doctored, while others, though impressive at a glance, get less impressive as you examine them further. Beyond that, the only “evidence” they present is stories-and that’s what they are, merely stories, and they’re inconsistent nonetheless.
Here’s my take on the events. As if you couldn’t tell from reading this far, I obviously do not think that extraterrestrials were involved in any of the events in Roswell. I haven’t done extensive research on this, and this argument may not be the best there is, but I do feel it makes sense. I think it’s quite obvious there is no need for extraterrestrials to be involved at all for several reasons, but two really stick out for me:
1. This was a top secret area controlled by the government/military. Obviously it was top secret for a reason. Now, conspiracy theorists will tell you that this was because of the alien activity, but I disagree. The military was using newly discovered technologies, not brought by aliens, but through scientific research, to create and test new aircraft and weapons. Obviously the area wouldn’t have been as top secret if we were using the same technologies as the entire world had been using to that point. It was important we didn’t allow anyone to obtain this technology, as it gave us the advantage. This wasn’t to prevent people from finding out about aliens, but simply to protect this vital technology from getting into the hands of someone who would use it against us.
2. I feel that the UFO conspiracy may be a conspiracy itself. Honestly, I think the idea was genius. If we could get people talking about all this nonsense with aliens and technology beyond the reaches of modern science, it was both intimidating and diverting. The very talk of all of these things was enough to prevent people from really realizing what was going on. People were more interested in seeing aliens than the technology our military was using. I’m not saying that this was planned, but I’d go to lengths to say the government/military didn’t mind when people started focusing less on what they were doing and instead on how? When the answer was very simple, scientific research.
As I said, I am certain there is more compelling information out there for both sides. These were just a few thoughts I had and wanted to share them. If anyone has any evidence for either side I’d be glad to hear it. I look forward to hearing some responses.
Tags: Aliens, Area 51, Bill Nye, Conspiracy, Extraterrestrials, Government, Larry King, Military, UFO's
July 5, 2008 at 4:13 pm |
That cop out thing on the acronym UFO being “just that, an unidentified flying object” has become a meme in of itself. UFO is not just an unidentified flying object. I’m sure you realize that those same words in quotes have a pete and repeat affect throughout the Internet lately. We’ll just add you to that long, long list.
UFO was actually termed a flying saucer back in the 50’s and it was termed an alien spacecraft in 1977 by name and not because what they saw were objects that were unidentified. UFO is mentioned as such in the Urban Dictionary and if you look hard enough you will even find the acronym ‘UFO’ in other books written by lexicographers as a flying saucer and an alien spacecraft.
The rest of your comments are completely meaningless since you said it yourself, “I haven’t done extensive research on this”.
Rule of thumb is, when someone has not researched something so important in a particular field, then they shouldn’t be commenting on it in regard to a blog article. Maybe a comment on a forum but as for your blog article it does not qualify.
So much for logical science because if you were scientific, you would present your article the same way we like to, which is by using words ‘a possibility or theoretical’ because it is.
Absolutely nothing is fact unless ‘at least’ observed or tested accordingly. If someone observed it, it then becomes fact for them and them alone. For the rest of us we can only wonder – but we don’t attempt to debunk it, especially if we didn’t see it first hand.
People were present and accounted for at the very location that it happened and of course on that very same day. Living or dead they all have/had a story to tell, which sounded nothing like last night’s program. Some of it was kicked up but the actual people and stories surrounding the day were but hardly mentioned if at all.
As far as Bill Nye goes, King always has a skeptic on board with everything he does that’s fringe. It sure beats Shermer or McGaha. Plus, even Larry King is sick of Shermer.
There ya go genius.
July 5, 2008 at 4:32 pm |
Well first off, let me say that I never claimed to be offering a “true definition” of UFO or anything like that. I’m simply conveying that I think that flying saucers and such, when referring to alien activity, is bullshit, for lack of a better word.
If you didn’t notice, I posted this in the Rant category, which is where I just go on about things I agree or disagree with. I said I was open to hearing others opinions and information and didn’t claim to be a genius, but thank you for assuming as much, I’m flattered.
Also, I find it a bit odd that you infer that I’m uncredible since I haven’t partaken in extensive research on this subject, even after I myself mentioned as much. Fortunately, I didn’t form any of my arguments based on supposed “evidence” and instead presented an explanation in a logical format that would take the extraterrestrial argument out of the picture. Considering I simply used logic and a different way of thinking, my not being an expert on the subject has nothing to do with it.
I also find it surprising you bring up theoretical or a possibility as terminology I should have used. I don’t see where that applies in this article, as I’ve said, 1) it’s a rant, 2) I’ve made no claims that something isn’t possible or is possible. Simply said I didn’t believe the conspiracy.
Furthermore, as this is my personal blog, I’m free to be as biased or unbiased as I see fit. I’m not a newspaper or TV station. Though I’m neutral in my informational posts, I’m free to do as I choose in the Rant category as it is what it is, a rant.
Lastly if you had read carefully, I said I hadn’t done EXTENSIVE research on this, though I have done a bit. Which doesn’t make me entirely uncredible. I’m obviously not an expert, but I’m not an expert in any field, and even then I am free to make assumptions and claims based on what I have found.
So in conclusion, basically you’ve made no point in your comment, but I appreciate the effort.
July 5, 2008 at 5:34 pm |
I made plenty of points here, you’re just cantankerous and argumentative is all. So actually the conclusion here is that you’re wasting your keyboard time. Besides that, you’re projecting an untruth since it is ‘once again’ theoretical and not worthy of debunking.
We’re done though because I can tell that you’re one of those individuals who would rather argue than understand what they read.
July 5, 2008 at 6:17 pm |
The latest Off Tangent Show with Latin
Provides audio proof for an Alien Agenda (psyh-ops)
Topics covered:
ET
UFOs
Mind control
Religion
E-mail
Anal Probe
small sample: Quoted from Time Magazine
“To most of 1,200,000 U. S. radio listeners who ran for the exits, peered down the pike for Martian invaders or otherwise conducted themselves oddly on the night before Halloween 1938, the Orson Welles broadcast based on H. G. Wells’s The War of the Worlds remains a booful, baleful memory.* They will perhaps never think of Mercer County, N. J. except as the place where a series of rocket-machines once fictionally landed, loosing battalions of huge extra-terrestrial monsters. For those interested in 1) owning a copy of the celebrated script (with indicated sound effects); 2) enjoying a learned laugh over the things it made people do; 3) studying U. S. behavior when a panic is on, The Invasion from Mars,* provides a lively, sympathetic anatomizing of the Wells-Welles ruckus by Psychologist Hadley Cantril and a special staff of Princeton’s Radio Research Project.”
ftp://truthdb.org/pub/lav/offtangent5.mp3
July 5, 2008 at 7:42 pm |
Oh yeah he loves to argue
Debating is great ain’t it.
I don’t see it as an ‘untruth’. It is a rant, rants are entirely free from the normal requirement of research or information; though the less research you do the more you look like an idiot. Same thing goes for it being a theory. He did research, it’s not like he’s going and shouting “TEH ALIENZ! THEY R HERE!”. As well as it being a personal blog, its liability is limited.
Nobody ever said it was the truth either. If he would’ve said that I would understand your point more. It’s also just as worthy as any other theory for discussion, and for you, debunking. That’s what theories are made for anyway. You dig for the truth by sifting through the falsehoods with discussion and experimentation.
Your point on UFO is interesting. It doesn’t say “alien spacecraft” in the name, but it’s been defined that way for a long time. Though, one could argue “alien” in this sense just means “something foreign” rather than an actual extraterrestrial vehicle.
He does ask for information presented from both sides, but there was no need to be so crass about it. ( ie “There ya go genius” )
Lastly I totally subscribe to the “UFO conspiracy” conspiracy theory. It’s an idea exteremely counterintuitive to common sense and our trust in our government, which is why it would work so well.
Thank you for commenting.
July 5, 2008 at 10:37 pm |
To Atrueoriginal;
I suppose the argumentative tone came as a result of your angry tone from your first post. You made points, though points that really don’t relate to what I said. I still fail to see how you think I’ve tried to prove something or not prove something. I’m simply giving an opinion on, what I currently feel, is a ridiculous conspiracy. I think you’re reading into it too much or aren’t fully comprehending what I’ve said, and to that I have pity.
And yes, I love to debate, it’s quite fun.
July 6, 2008 at 12:52 pm |
If you want to talk conspiracy, this is an excerpt from an interview with Gary McKinnon with Nigel Watson, wired.com (what he says about military domination of space confirms what Noam Chomsky says about the goals of the USA in space, which is by the way not a “conspiracy”. You can read about USA’s intentions to dominate space in public journals.)
McKinnon: A NASA photographic expert said that there was a Building 8 at Johnson Space Center where they regularly airbrushed out images of UFOs from the high-resolution satellite imaging. I logged on to NASA and was able to access this department. They had huge, high-resolution images stored in their picture files. They had filtered and unfiltered, or processed and unprocessed, files.
My dialup 56K connection was very slow trying to download one of these picture files. As this was happening, I had remote control of their desktop, and by adjusting it to 4-bit color and low screen resolution, I was able to briefly see one of these pictures. It was a silvery, cigar-shaped object with geodesic spheres on either side. There were no visible seams or riveting. There was no reference to the size of the object and the picture was taken presumably by a satellite looking down on it. The object didn’t look manmade or anything like what we have created. Because I was using a Java application, I could only get a screenshot of the picture — it did not go into my temporary internet files. At my crowning moment, someone at NASA discovered what I was doing and I was disconnected.
I also got access to Excel spreadsheets. One was titled “Non-Terrestrial Officers.” It contained names and ranks of U.S. Air Force personnel who are not registered anywhere else. It also contained information about ship-to-ship transfers, but I’ve never seen the names of these ships noted anywhere else.
WN: Could this have been some sort of military strategy game or outline of hypothetical situations?
McKinnon: The military want to have military dominance of space. What I found could be a game — it’s hard to know for certain.
July 19, 2008 at 7:20 am |
Time to put the integrity of these skeptics on the line.
If Bill Nye travelling by air, learned that he was in the hands of a 747 Captain who just radioed in because he figured his plane was being followed by flying walnuts the size of aircraft carriers – I wonder if Bill would be OK with it. The Japanese 747 Captain who did just that had 30 years experience when he as well as radar ground crew reported seeing UFOs the size of aircraft carriers following him across the ocean near Alaska. So if the FAA isn’t grounding these pilots, I wonder if Nye feels safe when he or his family is travelling?